Health Horizons

The current mental health landscape and the sandwich generation Good morning everyone and welcome back to Health Horizons.

It's great to have you with us.

Today we'll be discussing the rising mental health pressures in today's workforce and why these are being felt most acutely by the sandwich generation.

The sandwich generation is defined as employees balancing care for both children and aging parents alongside their jobs.

Let's start by highlighting why we think this topic should be a priority for all businesses.

68% of employees experience burnout while 73% struggle with work rellated stress.

Around 1.4 million people in the UK are sandwich carers.

53% of sandwich carers reported that they were unable to work at all or as much as they would like.

These stats demonstrate why supporting employee mental well-being really matters.

Especially for sandwich carers who are a workforce group facing some of the most intense mental health pressures today.

As longer life expectancy and later parenthood increasingly overlap, more employees are finding themselves in this sandwich position.

Research shows this strain drives declining mental health and physical health as well, creating hidden business costs through loss of productivity and increased absence.

This is a challenge businesses and healthcare partners must address together with a stronger focus on early intervention and prevention, helping employees access support sooner rather than later.

So, let's meet our expert speakers today.

I'm delighted to be joined by Sher King, founder and director of Sandwich Generation Support.

Welcome, Sher.

Um, Sher is a former senior NHS leader and experience coach who draws on both professional and lived experience to help organizations support sandwich generation employees.

We also have Rian Blake Blakeley, mental health clinician lead at Ber.

Morning, Rihanna.

uh and uh she is a cognitive behavioral therapist with 15 years experience in mental health field and currently the mental health clinical lead for booper's remote mental health service and also Dan co-founder and CEO at Jack uh Dan co-founded Jack or just ask a question a ber partner and in innovative online platform which provides mental health support in a unique and interactive way Dan we'll hear more about Jack from Dan later on in the session as always please send us your questions throughout the session and We'll answer as many as we can a little bit later on.

Uh you also love love love those uh brilliant polls we have.

So get ready for those.

We'll have some of those coming up uh later on.

Lots to get through.

So let's get started.

I'm coming to you Rian first.

So um let's start with the bigger picture on mental health.

Latest research shows that stress, anxiety, and depression now account for over half of all work rellated ill health in the UK.

What has changed in the last few years that has intensified mental health pressures across the workforce?

Yeah, thank you.

So I think all of us, every one of us will bring everyday kind of stress and the pressure outside of work into work and a lot has changed for us over the last few years which of course will have you know added to the pressure of the mental health of our workforce and for example many of us will be worrying about the the rising cost of living currently and you know alongside the wider worries about the uh social economic and climate factors that are going on and all of this is going to be adding to to our stress.

You I think one of the the big changes that we had over the last few years with the pandemic that we all had to navigate that uncertainty and the way that we've worked has changed since then with much more of us working in that hybrid way.

So many more of us working from home now.

And whilst there, you know, tons of positives with that, that absolutely can be those unintended consequences, the blurring of the boundaries between work and home life.

You know, how easy is it to jump on the computer and check your emails late in the evening?

So, does it make it harder to switch off?

That can then be added to our stress.

You know, another change that we've seen are the advancements in AI and tech over the last few years.

Again, loads of positives here, but actually could that be increasing the worry and stress?

Are we worrying about the job security and actually the pace of this as well?

These advancements that really fast pace, you know, having to navigate this um change changing the way that we work adding to that stress in the workplace.

So, we can see all of those factors just mentioned there will will shape how work is experience how stress is experienced in the workplace.

And as you mentioned before, your mental health is now the leading cause of work rellated ill health in the UK and 73 of employee percent of employees report struggling with stress and this just highlights you know how widely spread the problem is here.

You know on top of that other research shows that the average absence levels have increased and they've gone to 9.4 days per employee per year and represent 62% of all working days lost.

This is reflected at what we're seeing at BER.

So in 2025 alone, we had over 25,000 customers access our mental health service.

So of course when people are not feeling good in terms of their mental health, it is going to affect work, the productivity, increased absences unless our staff get the right support and help that they need.

Another fact I just want to mention is that I do think the awareness of mental health at work has definitely increased through the last few years which is great but perhaps there is a gap between that awareness and the practical support that's given.

For example, there's enough time or training given to managers to be able to offer that practical valuable support to to staff.

So we can really see that over the years you know stress has built up.

There's lots of things that have happened, lots of things that are still happening and maybe we don't get enough time to recover and rest between those factors.

So that's why we can see that you mental health is overtaking the physical conditions is that that leading cause of of absence at work and the implications are clear.

You know this absolutely needs our focus.

Mental health is now a core health place risk here and it needs to be addressed with the same focus um that that serious nature as we do.

It's physical safety at work.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah.

It's uh quite scary the acceleration, isn't it?

And absolutely.

Um it strikes me as well, we talk about this quite a lot on Health Horizons, but leadership comes into this in a really big way because you know people aren't going to park their challenges at the door, are they?

So knowing the situation your employees are in, knowing that they have children or an elderly parent they're caring for as well and making the adjustments is so important to uh to make sure the environment is right.

Dan, I'm going to come to you next.

So why is early intervention and prevention so critical for employee outcomes, engagement, and long-term well-being?

I think similar to Rian, the the headlines are pretty stark.

So there's 22 million uh days lost to mental health absence.

Um but I think even even sort of more stark to that it's a 24% increase year on year.

I think all the reasons there that Ron you you provided is just this macro compounding effect uh that's then playing out in in absences and then a you can see a really incre a sharp increase year on year but there's some really super interesting data that's starting to come out now that I think we haven't quite captured or or or properly understood yet.

So there's some research um run recently at the University of Queensland actually in Australia but it's a global piece of research because 23,000 global workers over two decades.

What that's starting to see is individuals are getting worse over time and cohorts entering into the workforce arriving with a lower base point of mental health than previous generations.

So if you look at those workforces that coming in their 20s, actually their base point of mental health is actually poorer and that's having a compounding effect because people are taking um more u mental health absences for longer and often the complexity of those is increasing year on year which is having a compounding effect within organizations.

So, I think we've really got to start to to um have an increased focus of those emerging work forces that are coming into the work workforce in the 20s because we can't ignore them.

They are our most important generation within work.

Yeah, sure.

And what do we mean by base point?

Does that mean they're like less resilient or less prepared to start with or presenting later or Yeah, I mean I I think you could use the term resilience.

I think that that's been a term that's been used particularly I think in the last 5 years in a workplace um um setting.

I think it's probably becoming slightly more unpopular at times in in in workforces.

So I think there is an element of resilience but I think it it plays into everything that Rian's said there.

If you think uh younger generations have been through co while while studying you have this this macro but intense environment of how we consume content.

we have so much more technology that's that's that we are much more present and engaged with economic geopolitic.

So there's all of these I think contributing factors that are bringing workforces in.

But I think also it's it's it's worth noting I think organizations are doing a really great job at making at breaking the stigma.

So actually we have safer spaces that we're able to start to be able to talk to colleagues or to your point earlier Richard leadership teams um to actually make make this um less of a taboo subject.

Yeah great thank you very much.

Uh so Sher coming to you as I mentioned earlier you're part of the sandwich generation yourself.

Can you tell us a bit about your story and how does juggling work, children and caring responsibilities affect mental well-being and performance at work?

Yeah.

So, um I'm an NHS manager by background for 21 years and I work nationally, regionally, and locally.

And I'm also a coach as part of that.

And then in 2019, my mom was diagnosed with Alzheimer's.

And at the time, I'd got three children under six, a full-time national job in the NHS and also trying to support her.

And to say it was tough is an understatement.

And I reached out for support and was basically told because I wasn't the main carer, which was my dad, that there was nothing there for me as a sandwich carer.

So I felt very unseen, unheard, and it just really put something inside me.

So sadly, my mom passed away at the end of 2022 and I decided to do something about it.

Um, so I set up sandwich generation support and I now work with um employees to who are in the sandwich generation to really see that they're recognized and to raise that awareness and to support managers to make sure that they're um able to support as well.

So yeah, as we talked about earlier, the sandwich generation is people who are caring for parents and then um they're in the middle and they also might have children as well.

And it's so prevalent now in the workplace, you know, it's it's one in five employees.

And when you just imagine your teams and everybody, you know, even where we are today, you know, it it's crazy, isn't it?

How many people it actually impacts and the impact on mental health for people in the sandwich generation is huge.

You know, it's um so many people I work with describe this thing of being everything to everybody where you just you're just pulled in all directions and you just can't do everything.

you're a parent, you're a daughter or son, you're a, you know, you're an employee, everything else.

And it's just overwhelming and lots of feelings of guilt as well.

And then in terms of organizations, this shows up in terms of presenteism, in terms of retention, all those kind of things.

And um actually 600 people leave their job every day due to caring responsibilities, which is just crazy when you think about that.

It's so so many people.

So it's such a big thing to be juggling all of those things.

Yeah.

Absolutely.

And it sounds like a really tough situation.

Yeah.

Alongside that from a business perspective, you know, if you're losing people and really good people because, you know, they they can't manage everything, that's that's not good either.

Rian, I know you're in a similar situation.

Is there anything you'd like to add?

Yeah, I can really relate to what Sher just shared there and, you know, was connecting it to my own experience of of being in this generation of having young children that I look after, aging parents as well.

Um, and the thing that springs to mind for me and it's been talked about already here is at the workplace being able to talk about it and feeling supported has been really really important and it kind of works on two parts.

Obviously comes from me to feel comfortable and safe to be able to talk about it to my manager but also feeling heard as well and that's made a real difference for me.

Yeah, absolutely.

And it's you know line manager plays such a role in creating a safe environment for everyone to be able to have those conversations.

um and then you know go on to make those adjustments.

And I mean I I my situation is not nearly as um tough as that.

But it's hard enough with my eldest has just got a mobile phone age 13.

That's pretty scary.

And then I've got my mom going should I have clicked on this link?

It's like well maybe you should just join up and have a conversation.

But I mean you know from a brain perspective it's um yeah anyway right we digress.

Uh so Rian, clinically, how do mental health uh the mental health challenges faced by sandwich carers differ from those experienced by other groups in the workforce?

So we've been hearing about the sandwich generation.

So those that are in paid employment, the balancing caring responsibilities for the young children, aging parents or relatives and being at work as well.

And the first thing that comes to mind are the competing and often unpredictable demands on their time.

And I always say care doesn't necessarily run to a schedule for example unexpected hospital appointments.

You get the phone call from school.

There are school issues.

Your child's poorly.

You need to come and pick them up.

You're in the middle of a meeting.

Yes.

So it doesn't always run to schedule.

So having rigid working conditions are just not sustainable here for those with the caring responsibilities.

And I really want to stress that it's not about lack of commitment or that motivation at work.

It's about capacity.

So those with the caring responsibilities, the cognitive, so the thinky load, the emotional toll is so so much.

You think before they've even logged on for work, how many decisions they may have had to have made before they've even logged on, you know, and and these care and responsibilities and that sustained load over time can show up as chronic stress and that exhaustion.

it becomes harder to recover because those responsibilities remain and it can leave us vulnerable to the experience of low mood, anxiety and burnout.

You know, adding into the mix here financial worries.

So, supporting two generations at the same time is costly.

You know, we mentioned before about those rising costs of living.

So, those money worries can play a real part in terms of that stress experienced here by our sandwich carers.

Another key issue, I kind of touched upon it a little bit before, was is around visibility.

So you may find that those with the care and responsibilities might not want to disclose what's going on for them.

Perhaps they feel it's too personal to disclose or they're worried about how it will be received judgment.

Will it have any, you know, consequences for them?

So they may continue to struggle quietly.

And as employers though, that there could be signs that we can look out for.

So perhaps a reduction in availability, focus, energy, you know, potentially we could misread this as disengagement, but actually these could be real signs of that burden and that overload that's going on for those with the caring responsibilities.

Another point to make is about the career impact.

So again, people in this generation, they might not go for the promotions or the leadership roles or they might step down.

just the thought of going for a role, the energy that that might take and the cost can just feel so high for them that they might not put themselves in those positions.

So actually what we can see is we've got the real kind of well-being issues and impact but also that workforce sustainability issue here with this generation.

Yeah, sure.

So really from ana from a uh uh sort of leadership perspective, it's really about knowing your team and being able to make those adjustments, but have those conversations where people want to.

Of course, you can't force people to have the conversation, but I think it probably helps if you know their situation to start with if they're willing to open up, doesn't it?

Absolutely.

Okay, great.

Thank you very much everyone.

That's been really interesting uh to hear how mental health landscape is evolving and what that means specifically for the sandwich generation.

It's clear there's a need for more targeted support for certain groups of the workforce, but also for all employees as we face more mental health pressures than ever before.

Uh right, we're going to move on, but before we do that, I know you've all Exploring support strategies, innovations and Bupa’s solutions been waiting for the poll.

So, do you feel your organization understands the mental health challenges faced by the sandwich generation?

Yes or no?

Uh and uh we'll tell you the results later.

Okay.

Okay, now for part two.

Uh for the next part of today's session, we'll look at the latest innovations and what employers can do to better support employee mental health.

We'll also explore the specific needs of the sandwich generation, which strategies can make the biggest difference, and how BER and Jack can support your employees.

Okay.

So, I'm going to come to you first, uh Dan.

Uh so for those uh who may not know uh who may not know it, can you explain what Jack is, how it supports uh employees mental health and how it fits into a preventative well-being strategy?

I certainly can.

Um so Jack stands for just ask a question.

Um we're very proud that we've been working with BER for over four years now.

Um, essentially we are an interactive digital uh preventative tool that provides access to a really safe space in a digital format and provides experts, doctors, those with lived experience on a real vast range of topics from uh addiction to depression to anxiety to to stress uh to sandwich carers, both lived experience and experts.

The list sort of goes on and on.

But essentially what it's trying to do is is three things.

It's trying to ensure that people stop seeking uh help earlier.

So it's breaking down stigma, it's breaking down access, and it's making sure people know where to go and when to go.

So we've used we've had quite a few I think occasions when we've been talking today that this platform was really built and designed for.

Um so we talked about those moments that that you could be a car and you don't know where to go.

Well, actually, it could be 11 o'clock at night that you you're in a moment by yourself.

You're not quite ready to put your hand up for an intervention yet, but you can go and find information.

You can speak to somebody that actually might be going through something similar to yourself and then revert to an expert to try and get some really credible information that that that sits behind it.

So we sit firmly above the clinical stream and then we connect and we design journeys and pathways that provide people earlier intervention into design pathways that actually at the point of need when somebody does need a clinical intervention actually they can be rooted into a ber pathway um in a really sort of pre-esigned and governed way.

All of our content is clinically governed um it goes through a sort of raft of checks through booper and ourselves which we're really proud of.

Um and this year sort of a marquee moment for us.

So jacket work is now available across 1.5 million lives across the ber book.

Um which is is a sort of an increase year on year that we're providing this service uh to booper customers and more so it's the first time that we've actually integrated and launched acrossme book.

Great.

It's a core part of our our proposition I think.

So uh cool.

Okay.

So Sher, from your perspective, what support does sandwich carers really need to help manage their mental health while working?

So I'm going to share a story first of all of somebody I've been working with who's given me permission to share this called Aisha.

So her husband is a shift worker.

So he leaves the house at half 5 in the morning.

And her mom lives with her who has early onset dementia and she's got two children as well, one in primary school and one in high school.

So, in that morning, he's gone to work.

She's already made packed lunches.

She's helped her mom get up and get dressed because she's unable to do that.

Um, she's also helped her mom um and reassured her with emotional things like I think her mom had believed that her own parents were coming back.

Um, that kind of thing.

Um, and then the WhatsApp parents group is ringing all the time, pinging all the time because it's the um the familiar thing of it's a school trip date which she'd forgotten about.

So all those kind of things going on and then the kids have gone to school.

She's taken them to school.

The carer has come to support her mom and at that moment she logs on.

Nobody at all in work knows at all that this is going on.

And this is just the impact of her story.

There are so so many people like that.

And one of the things I think the first reason she doesn't feel that she's able to say anything is due to she doesn't feel psychologically safe.

she doesn't feel and she doesn't think that people will understand because they're not aware.

So I think the first thing around um how we support sandwich carers is very much making sure that organizations have got that psychological safety and that awareness is there.

And again, I've worked with a chief exec um in a caring or organization who herself was a sandwich carer and didn't say anything because she she didn't want to, but then she did eventually.

And the difference that that's made by her speaking up and being so vocal to um sandwich care and mental health within her organization has been massive and other people have spoken as well.

So I think the second thing to think around sorry it can't go um with supporting sandwich carers mental health is around compassionate managers and I know we've we've touched on this already but managers make such a difference and again if you're you know it's 70% of people say that their manager um makes more of a difference to their mental health than the GP and their partner.

So it's a massive thing here.

So making sure that managers are equipped and able to have those conversations.

And I think the last thing that sort of makes a real difference to sandwich generation mental health in the workplace um is around that practical support and flexibility and I don't just mean like your policies you know have you got your flexible working have you got this what actually is that like in practice what does it feel like you know and as Rian said you know what happens and this happened to me I was in a board meeting and my dad's number flashed up on the screen what do you do you feel you're able to leave do you go you know really important NHS meeting it was like that moment Um and it's just having that flexibility and that understanding and everything together will make such a difference to the mental health um of the workplace.

Great.

Thank you.

So um create psychologically safe environment.

Um leaders role modeling so important in many of the things we talk about isn't it?

Because that kind of makes it okay if it needs to be made okay.

And then the flexibility building the flexibility.

Cool.

Great.

Okay.

So Rian, in your experience, what preventative measures truly make the biggest difference when it comes to employee mental health?

So quite similar to what what Sher's just shared there, um, and I will touch on some of those points, but the evidence on workplace mental health is that prevention works best when an organization is proactive with their measures and not just reactive to those individual support needs.

Is preventative measures are key and focusing on that.

And, you know, let's just think about the factors that can add to stress.

We've touched upon it today, but we know the factors like excessive workload, that lack of control, poor role clarity, job insecurity, insufficient support.

Now, these don't just worsen existing mental health problems.

They can actually actively contribute to the development of things like anxiety, depression, and burnout.

So, you know, preventative action starts here.

And evidence shows that if you increase employees sense of control over how and when they complete their work, this has a real kind of protective effect on mental health.

It means giving people predictability, that flexibility, trust to be able to to work you and we talked before about those demands on time.

They can be unpredictable, not scheduled.

So having that sense of control is really really important.

Flexible working.

And Sher mentioned this as well is another area where the evidence is very clear that flexibility improves mental health of our our staff with caring responsibilities.

It can really help when you've got those work home life conflicts again those competing demands and it can again give people that predictability but it's important to stress here it that that flexibility it's not to be fragile or constantly renegotiated because actually that could contribute to stress if um if that's happening.

The big one for me and it's been a theme throughout our discussion here, psychological safety and it's so so important.

It's one of the strongest predictors of that positive mental health at work.

So what does this actually mean in work in the work environment?

So, it's creating that safe space that employees feel comfortable to be able to disclose how they're feeling, to share their worries, to set boundaries as well without that fear, that fear that it's going to be judged negatively or um there'll be kind of a negative consequence to it.

And managers being able to act upon that.

So, reasonable adjustments can be made so people feel listened to and validated is incredibly important here.

And that's certainly been the case for me of being able to feel safe to talk up.

I've had that experience of being in a meeting and I get the phone call and it's from school, you know, with the children poorly and it's it feels great to be able to just say to my colleagues at school, no problem.

Yeah.

It feels it feels really, you know, safe to do that.

Um so we can see, you know, mental health in the workplace, it's not a nice to have an optional add-on, well-being add-on.

is so so important.

These preventative measures are key here and I do think the same principles apply as physical safety at work.

So with mental health, we should be identifying the risks, trying to reduce the exposure to the stresses and always monitor and evaluate the impact of our preventative measures with our staff.

Feels like um a lot of it is I want to say common sense really, is it?

I mean, how would anybody feel if their parent or child was ringing, needed some help?

I mean, I can't believe many people would go, "No, don't go and take the call." But but knowing you can and creating environment to make that okay and is so important, isn't it?

Yeah.

Um Dan, I'm going to come to you next.

So research shows that for every one pound spent on mental health support, businesses can see a 4 pound return in productivity.

From your experience with Jack, what other benefits can organizations observe as a result of supporting employees with preventative tools?

Yeah, I I think I think that [clears throat] stat's um quite well known now, isn't it?

The the sort of five pound investment um uh or sorry return from a one pound uh investment.

So I think that becomes your sort of downstream so your macro financial.

Um I don't think that actually takes into account the downstream PMI cost reduction or preventative um element to it.

But I think this really is broken down to to three main areas um for me um that are all um I think key components for an organizational to be able to to to build into their well-being strategies.

The first is retention.

So there's plenty of research out there now that's showing employees with a high psychological distress are 1.6 times more likely to leave within a year.

So that's quite staggering.

So again, I think all of these these uh both trends and tactics and strategies of of creating a space a culture a I think a leadership culture that allows uh employees to be able to be open but with policies that support that as well.

So I think there's being open is one thing but ensuring that the infrastructure and organization from a policy point of view um uh allows these strategies to be able to be implemented.

Um the second one is utilization um as a signal.

So um utilization [clears throat] across an ecosystems benefits and and um uh offerings for for an employee is super important.

So if you look at EAP, virtual GP, etc., etc.

A lot of the time they could be quite hidden within organizations.

So people don't actually have access or awareness about them.

So that's one thing that Jack really tries to to um build an infrastructure around organizations that we connect and we actually amplify those organizations whe whether that is uh my ber and and and bluer or whe that be a an EAP or a policy etc but making those much more much more accessible um and then I think the third is some really interesting data that's come out of the Gallup workforce report um recently and that's just about the expectation I think we now have as a workforce particularly with that younger generation coming in some of the data come out that shows 80% of the employees globally are disengaged.

So that's a real problem, a real problem that we need to we need to tackle with.

Um so I think aligning the expectations of an employee making sure that we create the safe spaces and the policies and the awareness particularly around topics like sandwich generation is is increasingly important.

And that doesn't stop there.

It goes into inclusivity into neurodeiversity and and and um so I think it's really important that we actually provide a setting that that meets employees expectations.

Great.

So, wrapping it all together into one.

I mean, it's pretty obvious, isn't it?

Make sure everyone can find it for starters.

But, but in doing that, making it front and center of how you're, you know, we're here to catch you if you need it.

Yeah.

It I mean, it sounds very obvious, but then you start to look at different um profiles of of work forces.

So, um there's often a term used which is the sort of hard to reach.

We try and sort of flip that on its head.

So it's not actually the hard to reach.

It's our job to be able to reach those whether that be a factory worker, somebody in branch, somebody on the road, uh a posty.

So um I think designing well-being strategies and programs that actually engage inclusively across the sort of different dynamics of and profiles of organizations is is super important.

Excellent.

And thank you.

Sorry, just getting some feedback live in real time.

Thank you very much, Dan.

Okay.

Uh, so, um, we're going back in time slightly, just in case you weren't ready for it.

So, uh, Sher, I'm going to come to you next.

Where do employers often get it wrong when supporting sandwich carers mental health and what should they be doing instead?

Okay, so I think it's brilliant when employers want to support sandwich carers.

It's absolutely amazing and I'm working with lots of amazing organizations who are starting to do things about it now.

But I think one of the big things that happens is people want to raise awareness.

Um, so yeah, which is great.

Uh, and absolutely the right thing to do.

But again, going back to that psychological safety stuff, every single session I've run, people have had a light bulb moment, at least one person with, "Oh gosh, that's me, that I'm actually a carer." So people just don't realize that, but once they do, it's then that bit of actually I realize it, but I don't feel psychologically safe to say anything.

So I think that's one of the big things that you need to organizations need to do psychological make sure that psychologically safe as well as raising awareness.

So a combined approach rather than just the awareness sessions I think is really important.

I think another thing that one of the things organizations do is put lots of posters up of are you a carer and actually the language that people are using I personally didn't recognize myself as a carer.

I was googling, you know, people who were juggling this and that and all the rest of it and so many people I work with don't recognize the word carer.

So, it's really important to use a variety of language um when organizations are supporting employees because it's really really important to help them to recognize themselves.

And I think the third thing is around managers avoiding conversations, you know, and so many manager training sessions I run, they're like, I can't I dare say anything.

either I'm frightened the person's going to cry or I don't know what the policies are and I I feel overwhelmed.

So I just I just ignore I can see something's going on but I ignore it.

So I think there's something there around just making sure that people and managers feel able to say and are equipped to be able to have that conversation.

I think you've got to do so you've got to raise the awareness with in a psychologically safe environment using the right language and make sure your managers are trained so that they're able to then respond to that appropriately.

Yeah, that last point is so important, isn't it?

And many leaders or managers are often scared of having the conversation about a range of subjects actually because they're not quite sure, but actually, you know, it's best just to open it up.

You It's okay to say it's you don't know what the answer is and come away, but it's better to actually start the conversation, isn't it?

I can give you a live example that we had recently actually.

It was from from an employee in in Ber that's had Jacket work access for for quite some time.

um and uh they had a team member um that was going through a transition.

So it was they were uh uh within a sort of trans transgender conversation and the manager at the time didn't know how to approach that conversation, be informed, equip um because there's lots of sensitivities around what to say, what not to say to make sure that you are being supportive.

Um, so they found the information on Jack through a a video conversation and they used that to be able to both provide them confidence but also provide them that space that they could equip in a conversation.

It's exactly the same for a for a sandwich carer.

Um, I think the more informed we can be as leaders and managers um to equip ourselves with those conversations that is only going to have a downstream effect on on a wider population.

Yeah, I agree.

Not having the conversation is probably the worst thing you can do.

So yeah.

Okay, great thing.

I'm going to stick with you Dan though so you're not off the hook.

So, uh, we know mental health accounts for a significant proportion of claims and the tools like Jack can be most effective when employees engage with them early.

What evidence are you seeing at Jack that shows prevention leads to better outcomes and helps organizations manage mental health related claims?

Yeah.

Um, so I'd want to touch on this from a few different angles.

Um I think from a from a business leader, business owners, um that that's obviously going to start to see some financial impacts by implementing preventative measures.

And then latterly, I do want to touch it from a almost like qualitative, uh uh measure.

So what are we hearing from from users and the impact that it's having on on their life um with some some some really sort of powerful life stories that that it's impacted.

So we're starting to see some really encouraging data now that's coming through from our clients from 20 uh 25, so last year.

Um so organizations that ran Jack um throughout the year are starting to be able to see real business outcomes that we're able to measure.

Um and that's through their claims uh values.

So not volumes but values.

Um and the large proportion of that is due to by providing a space and an intervention earlier on and then rooting people to costefficient pathways earlier rather than waiting 6 months or into crisis or when complexities start to raise um um and become increasingly uh um more tricky to be able to structure someone into the right pathway.

We're now starting to see really strong signals that we're reducing those uh claims costs by pre-esigning the journeys.

Um, so we've still got some more data to be able to really put that into an evidence pack, but I think the early signs, um, which shouldn't really be a surprise to us to be honest.

I think if you are able to engage people in the right topics, but meeting people where they are in the moment, um, with with well-designed, well integrated um, solutions that shouldn't be a surprise to us, I think, but it's really encouraging to start to see to see that data.

But I think we we founded Jack uh four years ago which was very much a sort of social um mission a real purposeuh driven organization and it was to make an impact.

It was to make an impact in the world and and make an impact to to to individuals.

There's one particular uh user that will I'll always reference, but there are countless that we hear almost on a monthly basis that we did uh we did almost an on-site activation in a in a large uh national bank.

Uh and a user went into the bank and actually saw some Jack content that John Jack content uh happened to be uh Alistister Campbell talking about his uh experience with depression and actually almost moving into sort of suicidal thoughts behind that.

And that resonated with that user that that or that that um customer that had been going through something and just didn't understand it.

Um to the point that they then uh sought uh intervention, realized they were bordering on sort of suicidal thoughts.

Um had treatment for depression um and then took it up upon themselves to to both contact us and that bank.

just to say that that intervention that one moment walking into a bank that might have been to cash a check or to do a transaction completely changed that path of that user's life.

So yeah, amazing earlier intervention really does make a difference.

Um Rian and I'm going to come to you next.

How is BER innovating to enable earlier and faster access to mental health care through our products and pathways?

Yeah, it's great great to to talk about the pathways and products that we have here at Ber.

So we have the the business mental health advantage.

So Ber's mental health advantage removes common barriers to care by offering the most comprehensive mental health cover in the market including support for recurring conditions with no time limits.

So this means employees can access help quickly often without needing a GP referral with ongoing support so that they can receive access digital therapies access to a large network of mental health specialists.

We've also got as part of booper's connected care pathway um the members first um which is uh it's a recently designed product so new members first treatment options for mental health talking therapies.

It helps employees deal with various range of of mental health challenges from anxiety, depression, stress, burnout and with members first the costs are waved meaning there's no excess or co-ayments and no impact on that employee outpatient allowance.

So they get fast access to the mental health specialists and that care that they need and it's made really easy and hasslefree with booking via the ber app.

So they can manage their bookings with the app.

Now member first is included as standard for all our new and renewing theme customers.

Um for corporate clients on our ber evolve master trust.

This is a core part of the product.

To access these benefits customers must have mental health cover within their policy.

And we've got bluer and access to digital GP and well-being resources.

So the the ber app I mentioned before gives employees quick and easy access to the care that they need from GP appointments, mental health support from a ber clinician.

Um, within the app, we've got lots of digital well-being resources, some some really great uh trusted content um that can can really help people to understand what they're feeling and perhaps as we were talking here and Dan was saying that awareness piece that people might then go on to access further support.

And then we've got bluer well-being which includes some great well-being tools such as meditation and mindfulness which could be so valuable if you just want to, you know, you're having a really busy day, you want to clear your head or you just want to carve a bit of time out for yourself during a busy day.

Some fantastic resources there.

Great.

[clears throat] So, uh, two different access points, digital and talking to people or self-s serving.

But regardless of how someone wants to engage, we've got we've got a number of options which is good and and good new I I really like the um um members first.

Sorry, I was trying to get that in my head.

I can't say wrong.

Members first is great.

Um right, Sher, I'm going to come to you.

So uh what's the cost of doing nothing?

Uh not just for individuals but for organizations over the next few years.

So I think if you're doing nothing, the cost the money is already ticking and the cost is already ticking.

you know, you're not standing still.

You're increasing the risk of burnout, of staff, of talent loss, and of long-term work pressures.

And this is only, it's not a niche issue.

You know, as I say, one in five at the moment that we know about, and it's on the increase with increased life expectancy and people having um children later in life.

So again, it's it's it's going.

Um so we need to do something about it.

and and it actually costs age UK share that it actually costs5.3 billion pounds every year to organizations um to do nothing.

So actually the cost is there uh financially as well.

So personally the cost um and the risk of doing nothing for employees is that um in terms of mental health it increases um the risk of burnout as I say of stress and of anxiety and depression and eventually people leave organizations as I say because of the unable to continue to juggle everything.

And there was somebody I met at a conference a few weeks ago who it was a really emotional moment because she just came up to me and she'd heard what I do at Sage Generation Support and she said that was me.

I had to quit everything.

I had to leave altogether.

I just couldn't carry on and she'd looked after her dad who'd had Parkinson's um at the end of his life and she said that she'd literally finished work all together to support him and now she'd just come back into the workplace again.

So she because she'd not had that support and she sort of it was real emotional thing for me of actually it's doing something it's making a difference and I think the sort of organizational risk of doing nothing is that you're risking losing people you're miss risking your talent pipeline um all those kind of things you're risking your retention as I say your productivity everything goes down if people aren't supported properly so doing nothing is actually costing your workforce their mental health and it's costing your bottom line as well doing nothing not an option either for your business but especially for your people.

Absolutely.

It's all about the people.

So Dan, from the data and engagement you're seeing on Jack, what are people most actively seeking support for right now?

Yeah, I think before I answer this and it's important particular for those that are now accessing Jack just to understand that uh the data that that we hold is completely aggregated and anonymized.

So those users that are coming onto the platform um we immediately anonymize that.

So we don't know who is on the platform at what time and what profile.

I think that's just an important point to to caveat.

Um but we are we see some consistent trends uh throughout the year and I don't think these will be a surprise to to to lots of people but burnout, stress, sleep and addiction.

So they're showing up persistently across different organizations, cohorts, large organizations, uh small organizations.

What's more interesting is some of the emerging topics that are coming through.

So employees are increasingly engaging in topics that may have been considered taboo a few three four five years ago.

So these are addiction in various different forms that could be from tech addiction could be from porn addiction.

It could be from various different addictions.

Um we're seeing sexual health, we're seeing eating disorders.

Again if you go back sort of four, five, six years ago, they could be seen as taboo topics.

So these are real issues that people are carrying into the workplace that might be a difficult conversation with a manager, might be a difficult conversation picking up the phone to a counselor, an EAP, uh um or a therapist at that point.

So providing Jack as a really safe space that that's that has complete privacy, but being able to surface those early conversations is is super important for us to be able to continue doing.

Last month particularly again we saw um an emerging trend of ADHD.

It's a neurodeiversity topic.

Um and particularly trying to break that down.

It's understanding it from yourself managing it at work and navigating diagnostic uh as as an adult alongside burnout.

And there was another interesting uh um topic of alipcia that people were starting to uh uh to engage in.

So that just shows I think the breadth across the platform that people have accessibility to.

But I think the ADHD signal is really worth context of this particular story.

So if you look at many sandwich carers, you're sandwiched in between.

It could be children that have just recently been diagnosed or actually it could be yourself that's had a a later in year um diagnosis.

So again providing that support structure and information and pathways I think is increasingly um yeah so really interesting.

We like to uh position ourselves almost the sort of uh front view window in a in a or mirror in a car.

So we have real data, real life uh uh data rather than looking backwards in previous months.

Um and I think for organizations and ber members, I think that's critical and this data is available to uh to to ber members.

So we can start to spot trends in organizations whether that be due to political landscape, economical environment or actually is there something significant going on in your organization that we're then able to start to spot trends and support your well-being strategy that could be a big restructure within a business or it could be a particular change within a business.

Um but it's really important data that we're able to provide people in real time that can support business and organizational decisions.

Yeah, great.

such a range of different things, isn't it, as well?

And um important not to assume what somebody might be challenged with.

Again, opening up that conversation.

Interesting.

Although the data is anonymized, but those trends helping businesses manage change, for example, is a great feedback what might be showing up on a few different levels.

So, we try and break it into sort of three different levels.

So, there's there's a cultural piece that we can support.

there is an organizational piece and there's a behavioral health um piece that we're able to start to be able to create data that as you said is meaningful to an organization.

Great.

Thank you very much Dan.

So Sher, last set question before we come to the ones from the audience.

So uh let's finish with one final takeaway.

If employers could take just one action in the next 12 months to better support the mental health of their sandwich generation, what should it be?

So I actually asked this question.

and I've got um an advisory group with party of care consultant with nurse from um around different areas and for lots of people on the sandwich generation and I asked this question and the big thing that came back was about manager training.

It was about making sure that you know it was twothirds of managers um twothirds of people sorry um over twothirds that saying that understanding having an understanding line manager would make such a difference and that really came through from all the people in the sandwich generation the one thing because then you bring in your psychological safety and everything else we've talked about today.

So that was the one takeaway from me is train your managers to support people in the sandwich.

Any builds from you two?

Well, I think the the the the manager one is is a really interesting one for me because I think what we often see with supporting clients is managers often translate into a managerial role with actually without any formal training that go into it and then the expectation of being able to support populations is almost lumbered uh with those managers.

So I just think that that content awareness but building an infrastructure that allows managers to grow and inter leaders uh I think is really significant to allow that type of change.

Great.

Thank you R.

completely agree with the comments here.

I think the the awareness is getting there and I mentioned that before.

We've seen that over the last few years of that increase in mental health and the workplace awareness but just bridging that gap to actually the the the right support.

Um so the manager training um equipping our managers with with further awareness in those tools that they can support staff and then having platforms like Jack which actually can boost an individual's awareness as well and perhaps give them the confidence if they see something content that they can really relate to.

That's going to give them then hopefully that that that motivation to go okay gosh I I've read this this really relates to me I'm going to take the next step.

So yeah completely agree with the comments here.

I think there's often an expectation, isn't there, for managers that that you've always got the answers.

I know probably in in many of our careers as you start to sort of move through if it isn't a management positions that there's an expectation from your team, your employees that you should but but that's now impossible across the breadth of different topics.

So again, I think yeah, an organization has a responsibility to be able to equip and support with the different resources to be able to let that manager to really blossom and be a really great leader uh to to teams.

just don't I don't know what you mean actually.

I mean when I know everything [laughter] it's fine to say you don't know, isn't it?

And then come back.

I mean that's just you can't know everything.

So anyway, you heard it here first.

Uh equip your leaders to uh to lead their people would be a pretty good start.

Great.

Okay, so before we get to a couple more questions, our final poll, I know you've been waiting with baited breath.

So does your organization currently offer any targeted mental health support for employees in the sandwich generation?

Yes or no?

Okay, we've had a couple of questions come in uh from the audience.

So, Rian, I'm end Audience Q&A going to start with you.

Um, how are we expecting mental health challenges to evolve over the next 5 to 10 years and are they likely to continue to rise?

I think given the themes we've talked about today, yes, I think with the pace of change in that the rapid advancements with the AI and tech um and the current climate we've talked about today that that stress is going to be there.

Um, I think we've talked very much so about the strategies that we can use to support our staff.

Um, and that that coming back to the psychological safety and what we were just talking about as well, you know, really supporting our managers because there's always going to be stress in life and actually to support our staff being able to have that psychological safety and space for them to talk.

But it's okay for managers to say, "I don't know." It's important that they listen and they validate that experience.

I think that's such a key point here.

Great.

I think just to build on that and and um not to be sort of too negative about the data that that's rising, but I think it's important to flag um there's lots of conversations that we're having in different communities or research groups that there is an epidemic that that that could be upon us with the rise in in mental health um severities and and volume.

Um and if you continue to look at this sort of compounding trend plus everything we've spoke about today with sort of environment geopolitical etc it doesn't look like it's going to get any better anytime soon.

Um so we have this sort of systematic uh responsibility um the likes of of ber and providers supporting to be able to support organizations to be able to equip themselves and equip employees uh and and users um to be able to try and tackle that proactively.

And I think without a proactive uh systematic uh um strategy um I think some of the trends that really worrying uh uh to be honest for organizations um and for us as as sort of uh humans um coming coming through that.

So I think it's great that that the conversation is more open and we're able to be able to talk about it more.

Um that's got to continue.

Uh we can't stop stop uh that sort of continuation.

Um but certainly the sort of rise of severity and and potentially the sort of supply and demand uh between rising cases, rising in in those with suffering with mental health and perhaps not that rise of clinicians across the pool to be able to support that.

So I think the system has got to be able to make some significant preventative uh designs to be able to support this.

Yeah.

Great.

No, I agree.

And also there's not a great deal of of empathy in the world these days, is there?

If you look at sort of global leaders, we won't have a discussion about that because we'll be here all day, but for lead for for leaders in our business, being empathetic with their people and and leading them in the right way and creating those environments so important as a a start point and people don't just leave their mental health at the door, do they when they come in.

So great.

Okay.

So, um Sher, we've touched on this a little bit, but how can employers and managers provide sympathetic support without um overstepping into someone's personal life?

This comes up a lot actually and I think it's really important that ultimately somebody may not want to share at all uh for so many different reasons I think that we've talked about today.

So, I think it's very much creating that environment and if somebody wants to share that's absolutely fine and if not then it's about respecting that as well.

But I think sometimes if by not sharing things tend to turn up in different ways for example you know performance that kind of thing.

So so sometimes it comes up out from that kind of conversation instead.

So I think but it's very much ultimately about you've got to respect you know people's privacy and yes you bring your whole self to work but actually you know if people aren't ready to talk about that then that's absolutely fine.

So it's but it's providing the tools and materials so that when people are ready to talk about it or do need that access to that support they know what they're doing they know it's there and they know where to go.

Great.

Thank you very much and thank you to all of you.

That's the end of our questions um for today and what a great discussion.

I think the key takeouts for me, leadership plays such a a key role in creating the environment, making it safe for people to have open conversations, then being flexible with the employees, showing some empathy, but also then having those things like Jack and other uh solutions that sit behind that give people access to uh the support that they need and want at the earliest possible stage.

So important.

Uh we've had a great discussion today about mental health and the role employers and healthcare partners can play to better support their employees.

Thank you to all of our speakers for sharing your insights.

We also touched on preventative health.

So, just a final reminder that our healthy cities program returns in June.

A great way to get your teams out there and moving.

Uh if you'd like uh your people to take part in the 30-day challenge, speak to your account manager and they can uh get it lined up for you.

And as always, don't forget to keep an eye out for our follow-up email with valuable resources um there for you to learn more.

We'll be back with Health Horizons in quarter 3 focusing on inclusive health.

Stay tuned for more details and thank you for joining us today.

We look forward to seeing you in October.

The current landscape & why personalised healthcare matters

Good morning everyone and welcome to our first health horizon session of the year and for the first time coming to you

live from our new accelerate space at Bupa ace in Manchester.

It's great to have you with us today.

We'll be discussing the growing shift towards personalized healthcare and what it means for organizations looking to

better support their people through proactive preventative approaches.

To set the scene, let's highlight why

personalized healthcare is becoming such an important topic for employers and employees.

36% of UK adults say standard GP prescribed medicines often fail to meet

the need their health care needs.

58% of people believe that access to both standard and personalized medicine is

important and for every one pound invested in prevention employees see an average productivity return of4.

These

statistics highlight a growing opportunity for organizations to harness the benefits of personalized health care

and strengthen the overall well-being of their workforce.

It is no longer enough for healthcare providers to just treat

illness.

We need to work together with employers to predict, personalize, and prevent illness.

And that's why today

we're really proud to be announcing that we are the first major private medical insurer in the UK to offer fully

integrated genomicsled personalized and preventative health care as part of our standard cover.

This is how we plan to

redefine healthcare by giving all of our customers access to genomics to help them better predict their health risks

and proactively manage these with our new prevention pathways.

We'll be hearing from Dan on the details a bit

later on.

We've got our resident personalized health experts with us today.

And I'm delighted to be joined by

Dr.

Rebecca Rora, clinical innovations and genomics director at BER.

Uh Dr.

Rebecca leads Booper's clinical innovation strategy and has played a key role in developing our My Genomic Health

product.

Welcome Rebecca.

Uh we've got Dan Sullivan, product and proposition director at BER.

Dan is responsible for

defining our UK insurance product and proposition strategy.

Morning Dan.

You and Dr.

to Ravi Luca who is one of our

medical directors at ber.

Part of Ravi's role is being responsible for providing clinical oversight and support to the

development and delivery of clinical pathways within ber.

Morning Ravi.

Right, as always, please send us your

questions throughout the session.

We'll answer as many as we can later on in the Q&A.

And of course, we've got those

lovely polls that you all love so much.

So, look out for those along the way.

Right, lots to get through.

Let's get

started.

I'm going to come to you first, Robbie.

So um health care systems both public and private seem to be facing

increasing pressure.

Can you explain what is driving that?

Yeah absolutely.

So um both public and

private healthare systems are facing unprecedented pressures um due to a number of different convergent forces.

So first of all we have an aging population.

So we're living longer which is great but unfortunately we're spending more of that time in ill ill

health with long-term conditions things like metabolic conditions like type 2 diabetes.

adding in um pressures after

the pandemic and um rising drug and treatment costs um and we have a system

that's increasingly focused on treating illness late rather than preventing it earlier.

In fact, the most expensive

care care occurs when disease is advanced uh complex and avoidable.

Think

late cancers versus early stage cancers.

And health systems still spend the majority of resources at the end of that

pathway rather than upstream.

But these pressures also create a huge opportunity.

Um, prevention and

personalized medicine allow us to identify risks earlier, target intervention to those who benefit most

and keep people healthier for longer, which is our purpose here at BER.

Um, that's better for patients, better for

productivity and society, and ultimately ultimately the main sustainable way we can address these pressures.

Sounds like a bit of a no-brainer to me.

Really?

Absolutely.

I would say that given we're launching any product today.

[laughter] Okay, Dan,

coming to you.

So preventive health has been talked about for decades as a solution.

Why hasn't it why hasn't it

delivered until now and what's made it difficult to include these types of benefits in private health insurance

policies.

I think that's a great question.

I think before we do a bit of a reveal of what makes up um our new preventative

benefits just want to talk a little bit about some of those challenges that you put out in your question there Richard.

So more broadly, you know, I think preventive health has been thought of as a silver bullet for some of the challenges that that Ravi shared with

us.

But when you look at some of the preventative health strategies we talk about, particularly in some of our workplace, but more broadly for us, they

tend to have been quite generic.

So we've asked people to think about exercising better or having a good diet

and nutrition or avoiding certain risk factors like smoking, you know, or alcohol.

But what is really challenged

when you think about both first maybe for a consumer or an end user of healthcare is it hasn't felt very

personalized or tailored to them like what are their health risks what are their health goals and also how can they

see some progress you know about doing some of those right things when you turn them to an employer you know we

recognize that employers under a lot of pressure in terms of cost in their workplace scheme.

So it's been quite

difficult for employers to be able to point to the return on investment from investing in preventative health.

It's a

bit easier to you know understand why you might want to fix something but making an investment before something

you know has become a health event it's quite tricky and quite challenging unless you can see a a clear outcome from that and then when you think about

as a health insurer as a health insurer if we put you know and as we have but you'll see our thinking is a bit

different but if you put preventative health benefits whether that's screening or preventative treatment into a product

it's quite hard to make sure that the right customers will use those pathways and those services and will benefit or

you won't get the wrong customers using that potentially repeatedly which is then driving up repeated you know

ineffective cost in terms of the product.

So we think you know that's why

that prevented health has taken this long and it's actually taken us quite a lot of work to get to this point today

and that's why health insurance is typically then focused on fixing acute short-term conditions and hasn't moved

in a really significant way into this step before.

So it's really moving from sort of more generic to much more

specific.

The science catching up in a way.

Yeah.

Okay.

Um so Rebecca, what's different now in terms of technology and

data that makes preventive and personalized healthcare uh genuinely viable for the first time?

Yeah, I mean techn technology is like a really key enabler for all of this and it's only really at this point that it's

enabled this proper shift from reactive to proactive healthcare.

I think there's a couple of factors there.

The first is

the genomic technology that we've got.

You know, the technology that takes a DNA sample and it sequences it and then

it puts it into a piece of code.

That the price of that has gone down significantly um over the last 5 years

and we're still seeing you know that that technology get cheaper and cheaper.

It's also faster.

I think the second

thing is around the data that we get from those insights um and you know the

evidence level that we have around translating what genomic factors you have to the risk of that causing a

disease and then what interventions are going to work afterwards.

So it's that kind of genomic technology coming

together with the scientific literature.

Um and then of course the use of data integration technology like AI to be

able to bring that all together to make those insights really rich.

That's important for us as clinicians because it allows us to be really confident that

the recommendations we're made may we're making are you know evidence-based and they're safe but also allows us

importantly to be able to translate that into a really easy to way to understand for customers as well um and for us to

be able to consult in a different way.

Great.

And it's important to say isn't it this is risk factors rather than you have got something.

Totally.

Yeah.

Okay.

Cool.

Dan, so coming to you, uh, what gives ber a unique advantage in delivering

personalized preventative health compared to other UK insurers?

Yeah, I think I think it builds on what

Rebecca talked about there, but I think about there's three key enablers and that's why now is the moment that we can

go and start to launch.

And actually we talk about you know the first step for us is personalized health we think is

going to be a big macro trend in healthcare and it's something that we and b are investing a lot in and we think it was going to define the next 5

to 10 years of how we think about our services within that I think there are three key bits.

So first up is

healthcare data.

So I touched on earlier unless you can spot the right customers who will benefit from investment in

preventative healthcare you'll really struggle to make the economics.

So if you think about the data we have from

our genomics pilot of 12,000 people, we've understood better in terms of how genomics and health and how customers

respond to that.

Next up is we do a lot of preventative health already things like health assessments.

So we

understand different risk factors that we see coming through and we're also in the fortunate position of having one of

the UK's largest healthcare databases being such a large health insurer in terms of claims data.

So all of those

things come together give us a really unique view in terms of how these health risk and these factors interact.

Next up

then is connected care.

So personalized and preventative health programs are a

bit more complex often but to simplify those and make sure that customers get a really good experience we have the

ability to manage that end to end.

So being able to deliver the genomic services inhouse, the primary care

appointments with GPS, geneticists, some of our specialist oncologists for example, all of those services can be

delivered end to end through a booper journey.

So customers aren't left navigating because some of the broader

healthare system, you know, might not know how to interact with that.

So really important that we can do that through the connected care pathways.

And

then the third bit is digital guiding customers through those journeys, tracking the outcomes, nudging them to

engage with the next step in that journey because of my ber because of the millions of customers you now have access to that we can guide them through

that well in a really intuitive and easy to follow way.

Great.

So really moving beyond being a

funer and and powering you know provision knitting it all together so we can give the full end to end experience.

Exactly.

This is really integrated

healthcare you know I think at probably one of our best examples to date.

Great.

Okay.

Thank you very much.

Well,

well, that's a great start.

Thank you very much.

Okay, it's been great to hear how the landscape is evolving and the

insight about technology finally enables us to deliver preventive and personalized health.

Um, plenty to think

about.

We're going to move on in a second, but before we do move on, I know you've all been waiting.

Here's the poll.

Uh, right.

Does your organization

currently offer any personalized health benefits to employees?

Yes or no?

And we'll come back with the answers later.

Bringing it to life – Bupa’s solutions, new innovations & future outlook

Okay.

Uh, so let's move on to the next part of today's session.

We'll look into the latest innovations and what the

future looks like for preventative and personalized health.

And we'll also explore how BER can support your

employees with preventative care.

And we'll be asking Dan to recap on the exciting news that we announced today

that we will make personalized and preventative care available to all our insurance customers.

Right, let's get

going.

Coming to you Ravi, first um could you talk us through the personalized health plans a bit more?

what uh do they involve and how will they support our customers with preventative health?

Yeah, sure.

And as we've discussed already, these are bringing these ideas of what we we think the trends are, what we know the trends are into reality.

So,

our personalized health plans are built on that kind of foundation principle that everyone's health journey is different.

What works for one person

doesn't necessarily work for another person.

So, these plans are about um designing it specific to people so it's

relevant to them.

So they sit in the my booper app going back to that that integration point that we just discussed

and offer clear easy to follow advice tips and tools tailored what someone wants to work on.

Members start with a

short questionnaire which gives them their own lifestyle insights um on things they want to focus on whether

that's fitness uh sleep diet or mental well-being.

From a preventive health point of view the focus is on those

early practical uh action and insights.

Each plan runs over three weeks.

Uh has

written uh video and audio content from guides and recipes to meditations and

fitness sessions.

And it's all introduced by one of our clinical leads.

So it's really exciting.

This is just

the beginning.

Uh as we expand the range of plans, we're building something that helps people take those next positive

steps in prevention again and again.

Great.

Okay.

Thank you very much.

So I'm going to come to you Rebecca to talk

about businesses.

So could you talk us through the benefits that personalized health brings to businesses and why it

should now be a priority for organizations across the UK?

I mean I always find it amazing that 80%

of our healthcare outcomes are affected by things that are completely outside traditional healthcare.

So genomics,

lifestyle, behavior, the environment that we live in and that we're not operating in a healthare system that

really accommodates that.

So that's what's so exciting about about this move.

Um why it's important for

employers is because um you know that cookie cutter approach um you know

one-sizefits-all just you know it doesn't it doesn't need to operate like that anymore.

Um and actually they're

able to be able to you know understand the risk within their population and then to be able to tailor plans and

benefits based on that risk going forward.

We know from your stat earlier that that leads to improved

productivity.

It also leads to improved retention.

We know that threearters of employees would rather stay with an

employer uh who offered some personalized health benefits.

So it really does make sense from the from the

employer and the employee side.

I think really importantly for employees, we also know that if you're receiving

personalized insights, you're more likely to stick with them.

You're more likely to actually um you know make that

part of your lifestyle.

Um and and so it it offers wider benefits as well.

Great.

Thank you.

So we've heard about the employee Ravi employer Dan.

Today we're announcing uh the launch of our

new prevention pathways.

Can you explain what what this means for customers?

I think we've teased enough now in terms

of what they are.

So now we're going to get into the uh into the grand reveal.

So you know we are really excited.

We

think this is probably one of the biggest developments in in private medical insurance um in many years.

So

um building on all that you've heard from from Dr.

Ravi and Rebecca there.

Um, our new preventative pathways will

initially cover four areas.

So, first up for that is uh we'll offer a breast

cancer prevention pathway.

We'll offer type 2 diabetes prevention pathway, a cardiovascular disease pathway and also

our metich medication check sorry product that helps spot for customers if they're taking regular medication

whether those medications will be suitable and work for them or maybe they should take an alternative.

Um so this

is a big shift.

Um customers won't need to be symptomatic to benefit from these

and they will take um digital assessments in our my booper app to understand using clinical um risk

assessment tools as well as genomic testing their risk of disease for these um and then we'll proceed through a

preventative pathway.

So if I zoom in on the uh breast cancer prevention pathway,

customers answer a series of questions.

um if they come up at an elevated risk they will be offered then genetic

testing including high-risisk gene uh panel which will test the things like the bracka genes.

If customers then have

a risk identified through that even when not asymptomatic they will then be offered preventative treatment which

clinically medication like temoxifen or um preventative surgery like a masectomy.

So really powerful statement

of intent and I think we're really proud of how we're leading the market in our cardiovascular disease um and also type

two diabetes pathways.

Very similar model digital assessment looking for risk factors.

Um we will then offer

customers our um capabilities around nutrition but also our weight management

products with funding available there to access GLP medication where clinically suitable for them as well.

So it's both

medication really um I think thoughtful risk assessment using digital tools and clinical including genetic testing but

then treatment as well and these will be offered as standard uh for all of our theme and consumer so we back that this

is going to have a really impactful impact so we're putting a standard into those products and for our corporate customers they'll be able to choose this

as an optional benefit so currently the medication check product is available for customers to opt into uh for

corporate customers they can choose to switch all of these pathways on uh from September.

And we've likened it a little

bit like your house insurer offering to pay for your smoke detectors, right?

You know, this is really invest this is

really rethinking right what insurance is there for rather than funding when an adverse event happens like a diagnosis

of disease.

This is actually funding and managing preventative health care before the event.

So, you know, we think um

we're just getting started, but we think this is going to be a really important step into a new era of how private

health care works um in the UK.

Great.

So employers can really empower

their people to manage their health proactively um for the first time with some interventions off the market

and I think every you know employees will then have a really good understanding of the health risks that they face and they can make some very

specific choices whether that's diet whether that's exercise whether that's thinking about you know going into um

having preventative treatment but very specific to their own individual risks.

Great thanks Dan.

Okay.

So, Ravi, from a

clinical perspective, what are the most important elements in designing a seamless and safe experience for employees using personalized and

preventative initiatives?

Yeah, sure.

So, there's a number of um clinical elements that we've already touched on but are really important in

in the design of these types of initiatives.

So, firstly, it's about clarity.

People need to understand what

the initiative is for, what it's telling them, and what, if anything, they need to do next.

So if we think about our

type 2 diabetes prevention pathway, it's about identifying those risks early, explaining clearly what those mean

without any jargon and so it's clear to each individual and what they then need to do next if anything at all.

Um

secondly, it's about safety and proper medical oversight.

So all these types of initiatives have to be um

evidence-based, clinically overseen, and have a clear route to follow up again if there is anything that's identified.

Thirdly, and this is really important, it's trust.

Employees must be confident that their data is confidential and used

responsibly.

Especially if we think about things like genetic data, that's obviously really important and paramount to any uh type of initiative.

Um, and

underpinning all of those for me is is integration, which Rebecca touched on already.

If we think about how

somebody's health exists and also their life, we can really build something that's personalized for them that's going to really help them engage in and

not exist in a silo or in isolation.

Right.

Thank you.

I love that clarity point in particular is you know people

[clears throat] worry don't they about their health a lot and actually giving you know real clarity around what the risks are and what you can do about it

is super important and Rebecca coming to you so looking ahead at future advancements what should

we be excited about in the world of personalized healthcare I mean I think we should be excited about everything I mean this is this is going to become

the new norm right so um I think there's there's three things I'm super excited about so I think anything as a clinician

that will allow me to be able to predict risk better is great, right?

So, you

know, if I can predict risk of developing cardiovascular disease or diabetes or breast cancer in my patient,

uh then that totally changes the kind of recommendations I can make to them.

It totally changes the consultation type

that I can have.

We can make some shared decisions around what is best for that particular customer um given their, you

know, lifestyle and and the things that makes us all unique.

For medications, I'm super excited about it.

So, you

know, Dan mentioned that medication check is is going to be one of the, you know, the elements introduced for

consumers andmemes.

That means that actually we're able to make recommendations around what

medicines work for people or don't work for people based on their genetics.

Um,

that covers super common medications like anti-depressants, antibiotics, but

also over-the-counter painkillers and some of those really specialist hospital medicines.

And actually that allows me

to be able to prescribe the right dose to the right patient first time.

Um and

that that's a total gamecher.

So we see in self-insured populations in the US that actually taking a very bespoke

approach to prescribing can reduce impatient and emergency admissions by 39%.

Because it, you know, allows you to to not try multiple drugs.

You can get straight onto the right drug.

You have

fewer adverse effects because you know what's going to work for you.

So actually it has really long-term financial benefits as well.

And I think

the the third is around the clinical pathways.

We're all used to having clinical pathways that everybody goes

through.

Actually the ability to be able to bespoke that to our own risk and the way that we might like to receive and

you know the best way that we're going to respond to care is super exciting and it's something that we've we've wanted to do for a long time in healthcare but

we've just not been able to get there.

Great.

That 39% is huge, isn't it?

So taking out the trial and error.

Yeah.

That's massive.

Okay.

So, uh, Ravi, what's the biggest misconception you see about gene testing and how would

you explain the reality?

Yeah, and you already touched on this already, Richard.

For me, the biggest misconception that I see about genetic

testing is that it always gives you a clear answer about what will happen to your health.

Uh, and that's just not the

case.

Um, for many tests in particular, and I'll touch on a few later, what it does tell you about is about risk, uh,

not certainty.

uh and that fits on fits in with um a variety of other information like your lifestyle

information, wearable data can feed into that.

The environment, family history and other things.

So you kind of kind of

put got to put the picture all together.

Um there are some important exceptions and we've already talked about some of

these exciting ones already or important that we identify them and deal with them appropriately.

So some tests do look for

specific genes such as you might have heard of the bracka genes in in uh breast cancer which really does increase

your your your risk.

Um and in those cases the results generally shape you know how we how we deal with patients

from a risk reduction perspective.

Um and that needs careful explanation again around that clarity point about what

that means and what somebody needs to do to address that.

Uh and again that's part of our breast cancer prevention

pathway.

Um it's also used to help with medications as Rebecca just said through our medication check.

um product.

And

again, it's something I'm really excited about because for the first time ever in in my career, you can really personalize

the the medication that we prescribe that we might nag someone to take.

We know that this is going to a work

effectively, but also have a a lower risk of causing adverse effects or or

side effects.

And that's for really common medication.

So, so we're really building into that personalized picture,

uh which is super exciting.

Um and so so ultimately it sits on a spectrum from

those higher risk rarer diseases to medication guidance to also those kind of broader risk insights thinking more

about our cardiovascular disease and type two diabetes prevention pathways that helps guide the prevention that you

can do kind of downstream.

So it's not about labeling people it's about giving that clear information earlier so it can

inform uh better decisions over time.

Great.

Thank you.

Um, so just we we've

got a couple more set questions and then we're going to Q&A.

So get your questions in.

There are a couple uh quite a few actually coming up.

Dan,

you're definitely going to be in the chair and myself just just to let you know.

Before we get to that though, uh I'm going to come to you on this one.

There's often a perception that more preventative benefits could increase the overall cost of private healthcare.

From

your perspective, will these uh benefits help address the challenges of rising demand and cost pressures or add to

them?

Yeah.

Yeah, we're very mindful of the the right to demand for those who came to our accelerate event in January.

You

know, that's a key focus for us this year in terms of being able to sort of drive cost efficiencies and help

employers manage the sustainability of their healthare schemes going forward.

If you look at the drivers of some of

the inflation we've seen coming through, it's a lot about incidents.

So, more people claiming on their private

healthcare because they need more support, but also severity, right?

you know in terms of us seeing more complex

latest stage and I think Ravi talked about this latestage cancer claims coming through.

So if we could intervene

and spot some of those cases earlier this will then have a positive impact.

Um I also talked about the four pathways

we've been very thoughtful about which pathways we start with where we have really robust claims and clinical data

that suggest this is going to have a positive impact on the sustainability of that scheme.

So our ambition is is this

is about moving money to focus on doing the right things with the right impact rather than having a significantly cost

inflation view, you know, in terms of these healthcare schemes.

And what we expect to see is that for employers, you

know, where they embrace preventative health, they should start to see then their workforce becomes healthier.

They

start to see some of those instances of verity movement move in the right direction.

But also one thing that employers have often struggled with and

I think we see it here at BER is engagement with health care has been tough.

But when you're equipping

customers with a personalized view and you've got really convenient, easy to access well-being and intervention

services, engagement with health, we think will also increase as well.

And just to finish, you know, one of the big

use cases, you know, we talked about Ravi and Rebecca about medication check.

You know, one of the biggest drivers of

uh health inflation has been mental health.

And actually for medication check, one of the very common outcomes

we see for medication is customers aren't respond that customer might not be responding to anti-depressant

medication.

That means that customer then mental health isn't improving.

They then become chronically unwell that puts

then higher cost psychiatry services demand on that healthare scheme and then all of the absence.

So this would have a

really powerful way of actually intervening is what's a very common driver of healthare costs at the moment.

Great.

So it's kind of multi-layer benefits, isn't it?

hopefully control medical inflation for the employer who's looking to afford this for as many

people as possible, but actually for the employee or the consumer, you know, much more engaging and hopefully get better

quicker or get intervention faster and ultimately, you know, have a longer, healthier, happier life.

Exactly.

It's like I worked our uh [laughter] our purpose into that, isn't it?

Seamless

almost by mistake.

Right, Rebecca, coming to you.

So, can you share some of the clinical thinking behind our

ambition for preventative benefits and how it supports improved outcomes across the four pathways we're launching today?

There's a lot of really clever science in in these pathways uh and in this benefit, but fundamentally it comes down

to a pretty simple clinical uh principle which is if you can understand somebody's risk of developing disease,

you can intervene earlier.

And by intervening earlier, you can either avoid that condition from happening in

the first place or you can diagnose it earlier and therefore avoid cost and

adverse outcomes further down the the line.

So, you know, that that's what I

always keep top of mind as a clinician.

What I love about it is it allows us to

consult in a completely different way.

It allows us to have much more rounded conversations with customers about their

lifestyle, their underlying risk factors, their family history, what is important to them.

Um, and you know,

we've mentioned a lot about people um engaging in these pathways, but actually if people don't want to engage in those

pathways, that is a really helpful conversation for us to have with them as well.

Um, so you know, by by being able

to open up those conversations and by them having the information to feel that they're in the driving seat of their

health, that they can have autonomy over their own healthcare, we can have some really good shared decision-m around

what the best treatment for them is and how they like to receive it.

Great.

Thank you very much.

Right, set

questions done.

There's lots on here.

Uh, but another poll.

Another poll.

Okay.

Uh do you feel your organization understands the value of personalized health for employees?

Yes or no?

And uh

hopefully we'll have the uh outcomes later on.

Right.

I've got questions for all of you here.

So I'm going to come to

end Audience Q&A

you Dan first.

Um firstly, is there an additional cost to employers for

switching on the new pathways?

First question.

Yeah, there will be.

So there will be a risk based charge that applies.

So um

it'll depend on the type of scheme.

So for corporate they will make a choice about how that is applied in our theme

policies we're reviewing the premiums.

It's actually a very modest increase to premiums.

If you then look at the way um

these benefits are structured for medication check where the benefit is get as many of the employees or the

customers screened in terms of their medication outcomes.

Um there are no co-pays or um any excesses or benefit

limit impact for the individuals but it would feed into policies um for our preventative pathways.

A very small

co-pay of100 pounds applies to each access to that pathway.

Great.

Thank you very much.

Okay, Ravi,

I'm going to come to you now.

So, do you think we will end up in a world where every single person has a wearable and

without this, do you think we can really move to personalized health?

Good question.

I'm slightly biased.

I

have two wearables that I use.

Um I think look it's the um it's absolutely

the direction of travel because as I said it's part of that suite of information that tells us more about an

indivi individual.

There's that [clears throat] risk part of it but also what are you doing um may I say

objectively as well what are you doing on a on a consistent basis if it's related to activity sleep what I use it

to personally for and how I can improve it.

So absolutely it adds into that kind of um information that we can then use

as clinicians to really guide that that personalized um messaging for each individual but also that prevention

piece as well which is what's most important about that type of data coming in.

Wearables also have really important

things such as uh high-risisk things they might tell somebody if they go into at a regular heart rate and then

somebody can go to their GP and deal with that appropriately and we're going to see technology within wearables just

improve over the next few years let alone kind of decades or so.

So I think it is really really important stuff each

obviously to their own.

you might focus it more on a um optimization kind of point around what how you want to go,

you know, be better at cycling or running or something like that or it might be more focus around your kind of health if you've got a chronic disease.

So, it's, you know, they're really flexible and useful for all.

Yeah.

Great.

Thank you.

I know in our Sanas business in Spain, they the

wearables like work with the app and so on and and the GPS.

It's super smart.

Hopefully, we'll get there.

Okay, Dan, I'm going to come back to you.

So, um there are a few for you by the way.

[laughter] Sorry about that.

Extended session session with Dan.

Uh so uh you talked about the pricing impact.

Um can we use this data to inform our pricing?

Yeah.

No is the simple answer.

So so

we're subscription um subscription we sign up sorry to the AI code on genetic testing.

So you we think this should be

a very positive uh impact on customers and I think Rebecca talked about trust

being so important in terms of how our customers engage.

So by being signed up to the ABI code what that means is we

would never compel a customer to take a genetic test.

They are always optional and you can proceed into the prevention

pathways without taking a genetic test if that's your preference.

What the ABI code also means is that we can't use any

of the genetic uh data that we gather to either deny or change the price for

cover.

So it has absolutely no impact in terms of your insurance premium or your availability of insurance.

It's it's

purely about adding value and personalizing healthcare to you as an individual.

So it's just about empowering the

employee or the consumer to take action.

Yeah, we have really strict privacy safeguards.

So we want customers to feel

in control of their health data and really using it to drive what they want and that's a key key part really of

that.

Okay, great.

Thank you.

Uh Rebecca coming to you.

So what barriers are there to people wanting to use genomic

testing that you see from customers and how do booper plan to overcome these?

I think genomics is a bit like wearables.

You know the best wearable and the best genomics test is one that a

customer will use.

So um you know part of the rationale for having medication check and the those defined pathways is

that there are different genomic tests depending on what your particular personal concerns are.

Right?

So, if you

are on long-term medication and you are concerned whether or not that's working

for you, then medication check is great because it allows you to be able to

understand for your current medication, but also for any medication that you might happen happen to be on in the

future, how that interacts with your genetic profile, and you get some GP time to be able to discuss any concerns

or any prescribing guidance based on that.

Right?

If you've got particular concerns about cardiovascular disease,

diabetes, uh breast cancer, then actually that allows you to to be able

to to look into those um concerns in detail um through you know the the

digital algorithm and then any genetic testing and then obviously um any onward

pathways.

So what we don't want is people lying in bed at night thinking, you know, gosh, I'm really worried about

that breast cancer risk.

You know, a friend or my sister's just been diagnosed.

I'm really worried about it.

We don't want you to be worried about

it.

Come speak to us.

We can help to, you know, allay and to manage that risk.

Right?

So, I really think that um you know that there's there's a genomic test available

for everybody based on their particular concerns essentially.

Great.

Thank you very much.

Okay, Dan,

there's a request.

Can you recap on which conditions the new prevention pathways will cover and do you have any

plans to open these pathways to more conditions specifically mental health?

Yep, good question.

So to recap, so the

the four um prevention pathways we're talking today.

So uh breast cancer.

So any customer at risk or thinking they

might be at risk of breast cancer can take a digital assessment.

We will then look at for genes.

We will test for the

bracket genes as well as other high-risisk genes.

Um and then we will offer preventative treatment including

medication um and surgery.

So masectomies and ofctomy which I think I got right take I can't spell it but I

can say it now.

So um and that takes it all the way through to treatment and then risk mitigation.

Uh we also then

have a type two diabetes pathway that includes access to nutrition and also

our weight management service.

And then the cardiovascular disease pathway is similar.

So digital assessment access to

u in bluer we have exercise we have fitness and programs but that those customers in that pathway have also got

access uh to the weight management service from ber those three pathways will launch as standard to all theme and

consumer customers from the 1st of September.

They'll also available to corporates for their renewals starting

uh on the 1st of September and my booper will be at the center of how customers use and navigate those pathways.

The

fourth we talked about is medication check.

Medication check will be available to all customers from the 1st

of June inme and consumer and our corporate customers can already add that

uh to their products today.

Great.

Thank you.

And coming next?

Yep.

Coming next.

Yeah, I'm not going to do a grand reveal, but yeah, we have not

stopped here, right?

So, um we are thinking really carefully about where we go next.

Mental health is one of the

things we're looking at.

Um it's quite a broad spectrum.

I'm not a clinician, so I'll leave it to my clinician colleagues here.

That's quite a broad spectrum of

things but you know there are other cancers uh in particular that we're looking at.

So you know we think there

are a number of areas but we want to do is to make sure that we do this in a really sustainable way so our customers

can understand the benefits and then we start to expand those as we see that claims and that healthcare data coming

through.

Yeah, great.

Thank you very much.

Uh, got any builds comments?

I think for for me on the places where we started for type two diabetes, cardiovascular disease and breast cancer

in the first instance, what's really important about that, I started off by saying we're we're living longer, great, but in poor health and those are really

important conditions that are driving that.

Um, and what's great is this information isn't academic.

We know what

we can do to address it if somebody is found to be at higher risk.

Dan mentioned with regards to breast cancer, the very specific things that people can

do if they have these high-risisk genes, but also for cardiovascular disease and type two diabetes, there's there's

things that we can do or advise people to do with support from BER that will help um reduce their their risk.

And

then comes in that engagement piece, that personalization piece about how them it works best, whatever exercise

mode that is, um whatever diet it is that works for them, and it's supporting them through that journey that we all

frankly live with dayto-day.

Right.

Yeah.

Yeah.

I think is right in saying that the for diabetic customers when they then go into hospital setting they

are much more complex and expensive for us to treat.

So this has a a broader

impact just behind that particular disease as well.

Yeah.

Great.

That's a good case for it all

around I think.

Uh so Rebecca coming to you.

Uh can you talk to the results of the my genomic pilot um that BER ran?

um

were there any long-term benefits you can talk to and will there be any further information released?

Yeah, so the genomic health pilot for those of you who weren't aware was a was a global pilot of 12,000 participants uh

in the UK, Spain, um and and some other markets around the world as well.

Um and

that looked at whole genome sequencing for actionable conditions.

So we were only testing conditions that we knew we

could do something about.

That's really really important.

we are not in the business of telling people about genomic risk that we can't manage right um and

that that gave some insights that I think directly impacted you know the direction of travel that we've gone so

99% of those individuals had a uh genomic variation that impacted common

medication um so as I mentioned before um you know that that includes things

like common anti-depressants that I would prescribe you know in my in my job as a GP antibiotics painkillers, um

things like ibuprofen that you can get over the counter, but also things like chemotherapy agents that that you might

have in hospital.

Um so, you know, just given the the huge number of people that

were impacted by that, and we've had people who um you know, have been on long-term uh tummy protection

medication, but still symptomatic with it, have had camera tests and lots of other invasive testing, and actually,

it's just turned out that they've been on a medication that they just weren't responding to.

So, we've been able to switch their medication.

They've been

symptom free.

Uh Dan talked about the anti-depressant uh case example.

That's

really important because if I'm prescribing an anti-depressant and somebody comes back to me and they're not feeling any better at the moment, I

don't know whether I need to increase the dose of the current medication, whether actually something else is going on and they may need a bit more support.

Actually, with these kinds of insights, I can just make sure that they're put on the right anti-depressant first time and I'm even even able to dose adjust on it.

The other thing that was really telling was that uh about three quarters of individuals had a polygenic risk score.

That's where lots of genes come together to affect the risk of cardiovascular disease, breast cancer uh and um and

diabetes.

Um and that's directly resulted in the in the pathways that we see today because actually we were able

to understand how you communicate that risk to customers, how we intervene and

the long-term effects.

And you know in the case about breast cancer we've had individuals come through with

preventative mistctomies and frectomies as a direct result of of a bracka new bracka diagnosis and that's you know

proven that actually that that saves lives in the long term.

Super exciting.

Right.

Thank you very much.

Ravi got

another one on wearables.

You're becoming our wearable expert.

How reliable is wearable data for detecting

early signs of illness?

Yeah.

So, um I suppose it depends on specifically which

illness um that that someone might be referring to.

And as I said before, a lot of this technology is is developing.

Um so, one thing that wearables actually has been have been focusing on is actually mental health, which I'll

start, which is quite interesting.

Uh understanding if somebody's maybe displaying signs of anxiety um or or

stress different to their baseline.

That's why it's so useful because it knows your baseline from however long you've been wearing wearing it for for

that that that period.

Um so that's one example of where it might give a signal

a sign.

It's not necessarily diagnostic but it can support that conversation you have with your clinician.

Um the example

I gave before the condition is called atrial fibrillation or AF.

Essentially that means an irregular heartbeat and

that's really important because it can give you symptoms such as palpitations but it can increase your risk of having

a stroke.

Now they have been validated for um for for diagnosing those

conditions or at least again pointed to the signs that you then get an ECG and further test.

So for example the Apple Watch I'm wearing can do that if you

just put your finger on the dial and it can can measure that within uh 30 seconds.

So again, they're definitely

developing in in that space.

But but to really hit home the point, it's about giving more information to the

individual who can then take it to their clinician and say, "This is what I felt and this is some also some objective

measures as well that's coming up with my wearables that will help support each individual disease diagnosis and then

you can go through the kind of gold standard proper diagnosis.

" So it's about bringing all the data together as you said before really isn't

it?

All the different data sources.

Yeah.

Because personally I I love that if somebody has that more information including that objective information

then you can really go off that um and and build this picture of someone to then give that that definitive

diagnosis.

Great.

Thank you very much.

Okay Dan, uh is this just a UK initiative?

Will it be

extended to Ber Global for example?

Yeah, so our ber global customers will be able to benefit from preventative um

benefits and services already built into their product.

little bit different um but yeah there are we have got a lot of

ambitions to roll this out more broadly also our businesses in Spain and also

Australia are also investing and have got similar pathways that are under development as well so this is a big you

know Rebecca talked to around a global pilot for genomics that this is something that the ber group is doing

you know across the piece as well yeah it's about being appropriate to location isn't it exactly and different products have

different design right so the way that this works will be slightly different but sharing some of those common themes particularly around uh personalization

of health.

Yeah, great.

Thank you very much.

Look, thank you very much.

What a great discussion.

Um it's been really good to

learn all about genomics and that brings today's session to a close.

We've had a

great discussion uh about the latest innovations in personalized health and the growing importance of prevention.

With prevention in mind, a quick

reminder that our healthy cities program is back in June.

Great way to encourage your teams to get moving.

Uh if you want

to get your people involved in the 30-day challenge, please speak to your account manager and they'll be able to

uh to sort you out.

Look, I hopefully it's come across today.

We are passionate at BER about our opportunity

to play a big role in employees and consumers health by um really living our

purpose to help people live longer, healthier, happier lives.

We're uniquely um positioned um to be able to offer not

just the funding, but also the health care that goes around all that.

And we we believe it's our privilege to be able

to bring that to you.

So, I hope you've enjoyed the first uh launch of that and and much more to come.

So, uh that's it

for today.

Uh and health our health horizon session will be back in May focusing on mental health.

Stay tuned

for more details and thank you for joining us.

We look forward to seeing you very soon.